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Converting other 3rd Party DS1 maps to DS2

bare_elf's picture

I know several people have made comments about converting other Dungeon Siege and Dungeon Siege Legends of Aranna maps to Dungeon Siege II as Iryan and KillerGermal have done. So I thought I would create a forum topic where these things can be talked about.

So that you do not have to start from scratch here are links to the files created by Iryan and KillerGermal.

http://www.siegetheday.org/?q=node/1330 KillerGremal's Utraean Seizure of hopeless Mapping

http://www.siegetheday.org/?q=node/1607 Iryan's DS1 Map Pack for DS2 Beta Test

http://www.siegetheday.org/?q=node/1607#comment-15445 Iryan's DS1 Monster Map Support Mod for Mappers and Converted DS1 Realm of Kings. This map needs work however both Iryan and I are busy with finishing the maps found in DS1 Map Pack for DS2 Beta Test so currently do not have time to work on Realm of Kings, anyone interested in working on this? If you are down-load the files and give it a go.

Dark_Elf has also started the conversion of Valley Peak.

As I have time I will explore Realm of Kings in both the original DS1 Version and the Converted version pointing out where things should go like vendors, NPCs, Quests and such.
Here are two Examples:


The Vendors at this location need to be activated, and in early versions of the DS1 map there was an Hireable NPC located here.


She was a vendor of all things in the DS1 Map

The latest versions of Loridan, Realm of Kings, Search for the Past and Training of the Hero
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_Loridan_Alpha3.ds2res
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_Realms_of_Kings_Alpha7.ds2res
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_SearchforthePast_Alpha6.ds2res
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha5.ds2res

None are feature complete but will at least load in DS2. They all require the Legendary Mod resources to run and support the Level Adjustment Mod.

Elf

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Ulyss's picture
Thanks KillerGremal

Thanks KillerGremal for this (old (2006)) site. I put everything what I need inside a PDF file (or DOC)

Again a question: DS1 have his own cheat codes like "faertehbadgar", "Checksinthemail", etc. Same thing with DS2 (imalittalteapot, etc).
Is it possible to have in DS2 the "cheat codes" from DS1 by "editing" some files like Logic.ds2res after I look inside Logic.dsres (or other files)?

Here is the "Garage Beta" forum (16 pages - Modding discussions):

http://web.archive.org/web/20071017183236/http://garage.gaspowered.com:80/?q=forum/130

KillerGremal's picture
A long way

@Ulyss: Do you know Elys' Garage post about this subject? - That's perhaps where it all started...

A lot of time has passed since then. However some things mentioned there remain tricky, some other things are easier to handle (meanwhile).

Ulyss's picture
Thanks for both of you

Thanks for both of you (bare_elf and ChickenGeorge)

When I have a chance like today or tomorrow, I put few good links (1-2 are "gold mines")

bare_elf's picture
psd works for all

ChickenGeorge wrote:
Ulyss wrote:
Tuesday January 16, 2018

Just one question very simple (but I'm sure the solution is very complicated):

How do you convert DS1 maps to DS2 maps (dsmap to ds2map or ds2res) [version 2.3]?

Thanks in advance

- First edit: Ok I have a lot of information very relevant (about twenty links or more). Just take the time to read all this information and move on to practice ...
If somebody have few hints, well let me know. I currently have all the "tools" to do a good job (I think).

My 2 cents. A good number of stuff is the same but probably moved around a lot. The texture files are now .DDS and are no longer .RAW files. You might want to batch convert the raws to psd. Then batch convert the psds to dds. If naming conventions have changed then so have locations of files, since many of them had abbreviated folder names in the name.

It should be noted that all versions of dungeon siege can use psd directly without needing to convert them to raw for DS1 and DDS for DS2

Elf

ChickenGeorge's picture
Converting ds1 to ds2

Ulyss wrote:
Tuesday January 16, 2018

Just one question very simple (but I'm sure the solution is very complicated):

How do you convert DS1 maps to DS2 maps (dsmap to ds2map or ds2res) [version 2.3]?

Thanks in advance

- First edit: Ok I have a lot of information very relevant (about twenty links or more). Just take the time to read all this information and move on to practice ...
If somebody have few hints, well let me know. I currently have all the "tools" to do a good job (I think).

My 2 cents. A good number of stuff is the same but probably moved around a lot. The texture files are now .DDS and are no longer .RAW files. You might want to batch convert the raws to psd. Then batch convert the psds to dds. If naming conventions have changed then so have locations of files, since many of them had abbreviated folder names in the name.

Ulyss's picture
How do you convert DS1 maps to DS2 maps?

Tuesday January 16, 2018

Just one question very simple (but I'm sure the solution is very complicated):

How do you convert DS1 maps to DS2 maps (dsmap to ds2map or ds2res) [version 2.3]?

Thanks in advance

- First edit: Ok I have a lot of information very relevant (about twenty links or more). Just take the time to read all this information and move on to practice ...
If somebody have few hints, well let me know. I currently have all the "tools" to do a good job (I think).

bare_elf's picture
Welcome Ulyss

Ulyss wrote:
I have the french version of "Training of the Hero": La Formation du héros

- Hero_french.dsmap - version 1.1 (2,57 Mo)
- Single player map designed for accelerated progression. Approximately 3 hours of gameplay on Normal difficulty. (Map is in French.)
- With DsloaMod = 3 known bugs!
- See the Heros 1.1.zip with 9 pictures + file DOC + Hero.dsmap

I have approximately 200 siegelets/maps in French, English, Russian, Japanese, Hebrew, German, etc

Welcome to SiegetheDay we are always interested in maps for any version of Dungeon Siege in any language. We have members from all over the world so they may like maps in their own language.

Elf

Ulyss's picture
Hero_french.dsmap

I have the french version of "Training of the Hero": La Formation du héros

- Hero_french.dsmap - version 1.1 (2,57 Mo)
- Single player map designed for accelerated progression. Approximately 3 hours of gameplay on Normal difficulty. (Map is in French.)
- With DsloaMod = 3 known bugs!
- See the Heros 1.1.zip with 9 pictures + file DOC + Hero.dsmap

I have approximately 200 siegelets/maps in French, English, Russian, Japanese, Hebrew, German, etc

AttachmentSize
Heros 1.1.zip 7.09 MB
Loridan, Braak Mage Had

Loridan, Braak Mage

Had the pointer over this Braak Mage and he did not show stats or outline, could not attack with selected character rest of party only attacked in response to the Braak attacking This only occurred for a few of the braak mages. I took 2 different parties in and this occured both times. To emphasize, only 3 or 4 of the Braak Mages between the Little Hole ant the teleport platform had this problem

Insane Dwarf

Reply to RSimkinuk57, I was

Reply to RSimkinuk57, I was using the Giant character from DarkElf's GiantGnome mod :woot: if you use the Gnome the character fit entirely under the boardwalk Laughing out loud

Dwarf

Reply to @sigofmugmort

sigofmugmort wrote:
Like the illusionary wall.

The last battle was way to easy, it is possible to engage one of the opponents without triggering the others and the attack speed of the Generals is so slow they died without doing any damage.


Credit to Psychogun2003 for all of these.

Easy last battle yes, but my one against the old hero at level 9 made up for that.

sigofmugmort wrote:

If you Die a second time on the beach (those are some NASTY chickens Woot! ) you cannot return but if you save and exit you will recover your items.

Lucky you. I cannot get down to the beach - my platform still gets stuck in mid-air above it. I have:

DS2 CD + 2.2 patch
Legendary-Mod-Betav30-Installer (All*Saves for 2.2 installed)
Mod-DS1Content-Alpha10v (Alpha10u removed from Resources folder)
Mod-Erthos-MonsterLevelAdjust-Beta5j (Beta5h removed from Resources folder)
DS2_Map_Selection_Menu_Fix_v1
DS1_Map_Realms_of_Kings_Alpha7
DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha5 (Alpha3 and Alpha4 removed from Resources folder)

I think both my current TotH test parties were started anew on Alpha5.

How did you get your earlier (24-08-2014) screenshot of character's legs lost underneath the swamp boardwalk? I thought I knew, but when I put my party into the water then start them moving underneath the walk from one side of it to the other, only heads stick up through it, except for Pedro from waist up, but your character is showing a bit more than that.

Everything about the boardwalk is working correctly (that is, like GPG's swamp boardwalks in DS1). I have tested for the problem I had (or thought I had) in DS1 TotH, of being unable to shoot to/from the walk, and have found no such problem now.

I'm holding back further results from TotH while @iryan and @bare_elf work on Ordus' Axe and other things in Ehb. (I might be going there myself to compare some points of interest.)

TotH, The Barren Desert It

TotH, The Barren Desert

It is interesting to stand in Lava and take no damage, which is possible in the small pools in the small dungeon.

Like the illusionary wall.

The last battle was way to easy, it is possible to engage one of the opponents without triggering the others and the attack speed of the Generals is so slow they died without doing any damage.

Dwarf

Training of the Hero, Chests

Training of the Hero, Chests work nicely and Pedro and Magic act normally tho they do not have recruit-able icons.

I was pointing out that even with a key a player can still slightly mess up the quest.

In TotH and Search for the past there are fires in fireplaces that have the flames going Down instead of up :silly:

If you Die a second time on the beach (those are some NASTY chickens :woot: ) you cannot return but if you save and exit you will recover your items.

bare_elf's picture
No Longer an Issue in Alpha5

sigofmugmort wrote:
If you enter the Crypt first you get the quest but after completing the quest a white star remains in the Crypts

This along with the other two quests found in and near Frontenac you can not complete the quest without being given the quest. There is now a key that locks the crypt so you can not get the stone without talking to the quest giver. You can not clear the forest house of bandits without the key and the giant rat does not exist until you get the quest.

Elf

Training of the Hero: alpha 5 -EDITed

sigofmugmort wrote:
Existence ends here :jawdrop: :silly:
Tell Pyschogun2003.

sigofmugmort wrote:
If you enter the Crypt first you get the quest but after completing the quest a white star remains in the Crypts
A5#010. That is because Task 1 was not ticked, only Task 2, Task 3 and the Quest. To tick Task 1 you must have the Quest before entering the Crypts for the first time.

A5#011. Skone quest, Find-Oracle quest and Rescue Mission quest do not offer Save when you complete them. (Fossile's rat quest and Mountain Pass quest do) The three that do not have in common that they are all completed by conversations.

A5#012. Find-Oracle quest completes (ticked off) when you talk to Oracle, but its Task 3 never ticked.

A5#013. Rescue Mission quest completes only when you hire Pedro - not if you choose to refuse him, or are forced to because your party is full. Disband someone, succeed in hiring him second time, then it completes.

A5#902. (#900+ = trivia and personal opinions) Youstofrai if you hire him is now a mage in robes (thank you), but before you hire him still looks like a swordsman in studded leather.

A5#903. Karma still has Quick Draw even if at too low a level for it. (At least this means that on reaching Ranged 4 she will be able to use a Throwing-Knife-needs-Ranged-4-but-also-Quick-Draw-which-usually-means-Ranged-5, thank you GPG) On the other hand, has she left elfdom in shame for failing at Brilliance?

sigofmugmort wrote:
Shrine floating in air Laughing out loud There is a marginally flatter area just to the statues rear, up slope
A5#904. Suggest shrine would be more useful at the foot of the hill, on the left of the path where Karma and the camp are on the right. Hero shouldn't have too much trouble with the Alpha Wolf and pack (and if staying right on the prairie won't meet it) whereas things get tougher going up.

A5#905. Mind you, what really makes going up tough is the mine worm, which I think is playing far too hard compared to everything else. (Is this a problem with the Legendary Mod generally? It certainly will be in Realm of Kings' swamp side area. What makes it worse is that I cannot even see when and where the worm's [stream of poison/slivers-of-rock/whatever-it-spits-out] is landing.)

A5#014. Coming out of cave onto snow, where Col de Tournecle legend comes up: large blank (black) section of radar image background.

EDIT. Running late, I forgot to say I'd seen Pedro finishing off his Ice Fly (seen it several times). It works well and I really like his voice-over when one greets him.

Training of the Hero The

Training of the Hero

The Radar Map for the Beach shows the town and if you return to town Its Radar Map shows the Beach

If you enter the Crypt first you get the quest but after completing the quest a white star remains in the Crypts

Magic does not have a recruit-able icon over his head

Existence ends here :jawdrop: :silly:

Shrine floating in air Laughing out loud There is a marginally flatter area just to the statues rear, up slope

Now, Into the Dessert (hopefully without colliding with a rampaging Elf Tongue :goofy: )

Dwarf

KillerGremal's picture
Object properties

iryan wrote:
. . .

Currently I'm experimenting with a gizmo of KillerGremal's that makes objects invisible until a quest task is active. I also have to restart in order to see if the fix for the Oracle's cellar door works.

If you have the custom component invisible_on_event_simple.skrit in mind, it only works for objects (assuming selectivity+usability+invisibility are in sync), not for monsters (there is no mind handling).
GPG normally used the command object 'cmd_change_property' where you can define before-and-after states for almost any property an object/monster can have. But it's a tricky object/component with a little vulnerability too...
Perhaps also a flick-trigger on a object/monster itself could work to change its own properties depending on quest states. For monsters there actually would be the convenient Disable/Enable commands (remind however that flick-triggers often don't work with we_killed, not to implement something based on this lack).

Concerning doors, there should be an option in their coomponent to lock the door and to wait for an activation before the player can use it. Usually this is sufficient, only with a few doors the path-blocking handing doesn't work sometimes because they are too thin or easily tend to be placed above ground.

bare_elf's picture
In Mournine

In Mournine
All the quests are given and received correctly. The rescue mission now completes correctly. All the doors work, the stash is there.
All is well with Youstofrai
Pedro on the other hand is having a bad hair day and is really confused or is at least plagiarizing his conversation as what he says is the same as Karma's conversation and he asks you to help him to Mournine and we are already there. Must have been drinking in the pub before going in to the ice cave.

Elf

bare_elf's picture
Thanks Iryan

Thank you for installing the stash trunk in Frontenac, thank you for fixing Karma's skin now she is all the same color kind of a greenish gray which is perfect for a forest elf.
All seems to be going great. All the quests in and around Frontenac can not be completed without first getting the quest. Karma and I are about to run up the mountain, but I thought I would check in first just in case we pass away in the pass ha ha.

Elf

bare_elf's picture
It must be Saturday in OZ

iryan wrote:
Rather quickly here's another update to Training of the Hero caused by issues to some recruitable ai bought to my attention by sigofmugmort. http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha5.ds2res

I used a slightly modified brain_hero.skrit for Pedro and Magic and removed movement_orders = mo_hold from the instances. This is what was causing the characters to stay put when rampage mode was activated. Mirror mode obviously overrides this setting. The only weird thing you notice about Pedro and Magic when in mirror mode is that they will defend themselves if attacked by a melee monster. They'll ignore magic or ranged attacks.

Please test them out and if they work I'll update all other instances of the same type, Ulora, Gloern, Mhankur, etc.

I also placed the stash container in several locations in the map and touched up Karma's textures (will need to rehire her again to see the difference).


Two updates in less than 24 hours! I will check out the changes and updates just as soon as I am able. Since I was only in Frontenac restarting will not be a problem. I had just hired Karma, but I had not done much else. Let you know what I discover.

Elf

Training of the Hero Alpha 5 Update

Rather quickly here's another update to Training of the Hero caused by issues to some recruitable ai bought to my attention by sigofmugmort.
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha5.ds2res

I used a slightly modified brain_hero.skrit for Pedro and Magic and removed movement_orders = mo_hold from the instances. This is what was causing the characters to stay put when rampage mode was activated. Mirror mode obviously overrides this setting. The only weird thing you notice about Pedro and Magic when in mirror mode is that they will defend themselves if attacked by a melee monster. They'll ignore magic or ranged attacks.

Please test them out and if they work I'll update all other instances of the same type, Ulora, Gloern, Mhankur, etc.

I also placed the stash container in several locations in the map and touched up Karma's textures (will need to rehire her again to see the difference).

Textures and Storage Stash

bare_elf wrote:
Yes the quests work much better. Tried to go the three quests in Frontenac prior to getting them and was not allowed to get the items or kill the things without getting the quest first. Great Job. Now two things that need correction. There is no yellow storage vault anywhere in Frontenac I am not sure if there was one before, but would be nice as I had stuff stored there from another map that I was hoping to use. No big deal. Now for the big deal, Poor Karma has the same skin mismatch as she had in the last version of the map. I think there is something wrong with texture 0 as she has a pink head and a green body. This texture might need changing 0 = b_c_gah_ef_npc-003; Not sure which one but her head needs to be green like her body.

Elf


Yes I forgot to place storage stashes in the map. Will be done of course.

I see what you mean about Karma but it looks more like gray to me than green. Actually the correct skin is b_c_gah_ef_npc-005 but there's no available portraits matching that shade other than Finala's. I've changed her armor texture ( that's the 1 = ) from 12 to 11 so her neck and hands are a better shade.

While you're testing the map could you try seeing how Pedro and Magic act in the party? Sigofmugmort has brought to my attention a possible lack in the way I set up the initial encounters with these characters that may make them misbehave when in the party. If you're using the auto-engage mod you'll need to disable it.

bare_elf's picture
Training of the Hero Alpha4

iryan wrote:
Training of the Hero has been updated to Alpha 4. http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha4.ds2res

You should be able to complete all quests now and also access the hidden level (but not return from it yet), though that's for testing as you don't require the artefacts at the moment.

Still needs a lot of polish but its getting there.


Yes the quests work much better. Tried to go the three quests in Frontenac prior to getting them and was not allowed to get the items or kill the things without getting the quest first. Great Job. Now two things that need correction. There is no yellow storage vault anywhere in Frontenac I am not sure if there was one before, but would be nice as I had stuff stored there from another map that I was hoping to use. No big deal. Now for the big deal, Poor Karma has the same skin mismatch as she had in the last version of the map. I think there is something wrong with texture 0 as she has a pink head and a green body. This texture might need changing 0 = b_c_gah_ef_npc-003; Not sure which one but her head needs to be green like her body.

Elf

New Training of the Hero update

Training of the Hero has been updated to Alpha 4.
http://www.siegetheday.org/~iryan/files/Third_Party_Maps/DS1_Map_TrainingoftheHero_Alpha4.ds2res

You should be able to complete all quests now and also access the hidden level (but not return from it yet), though that's for testing as you don't require the artefacts at the moment.

Still needs a lot of polish but its getting there.

Re: Finished the Original

bare_elf wrote:
Finished the original "Training of the Hero" and noted that if you complete a step in a quest without first either getting the quest or completing the previous part of the quest the game will not allow you to complete the quest. So I decided to look at a few other DS1 maps by both Psychogun2003 and others. In most cases to prevent a person from completing a section of a quest prior to either receiving the quest or completing a previous section. The path to the out of order quest area was almost always blocked by a door that required you to have a key or some special item in your inventory. Very much like Dreu's treasure hunt quest in Dungeon Siege 2. You need both a key that you receive from the prior section of the quest and you must have her selected as the primary character. This is also true of the vision quest. You must have a particular person in your party before anything happens. So I was thinking maybe using the same principle would work for quest elements in the converted DS1 maps. There could be a door blocking the entrance to Zerk's Cave that would require having Magic Tcherniat in your party and/or the Major could give you a key to the door as when you are in winstone fortress and you need to fill the silly bowl from the fountain and the guard captain gives you the key for saving his men. Now I know your saying but if the door is locked how did the dragons get out to attack the fort? Simple answer, the door you are required to open is the door for the dragon keepers, who can not fly. Now I am sure there must be other exits from the cave which dragons could fly through. I mean it looks as if Zerk is in some type of chimney or maybe a volcano so up would be out if you could fly.

Elf

Again I've already implemented the exact same solution. Do Great minds think alike or is it the other way around. Tongue

I used a very small gate to block access with warning signs attached, so it's quite plausible for drakes to be able to fly over the fence and of course if they could really fly all they need to do is fly across the small canyon between Zerk's cave and the Fort.

The Major gives you a key to unlock the gate and explains the gate was to prevent travellers from unwittingly stumbling into the cave by accident, which would be unfortunate for them. A play on the previous ability of players to be able to break the questline if they went and killed Zerk out of order.

Currently I'm experimenting with a gizmo of KillerGremal's that makes objects invisible until a quest task is active. I also have to restart in order to see if the fix for the Oracle's cellar door works.

bare_elf's picture
Finished the Original

Finished the original "Training of the Hero" and noted that if you complete a step in a quest without first either getting the quest or completing the previous part of the quest the game will not allow you to complete the quest. So I decided to look at a few other DS1 maps by both Psychogun2003 and others. In most cases to prevent a person from completing a section of a quest prior to either receiving the quest or completing a previous section. The path to the out of order quest area was almost always blocked by a door that required you to have a key or some special item in your inventory. Very much like Dreu's treasure hunt quest in Dungeon Siege 2. You need both a key that you receive from the prior section of the quest and you must have her selected as the primary character. This is also true of the vision quest. You must have a particular person in your party before anything happens.
So I was thinking maybe using the same principle would work for quest elements in the converted DS1 maps. There could be a door blocking the entrance to
Zerk's Cave that would require having Magic Tcherniat in your party and/or the Major could give you a key to the door as when you are in winstone fortress and you need to fill the silly bowl from the fountain and the guard captain gives you the key for saving his men. Now I know your saying but if the door is locked how did the dragons get out to attack the fort? Simple answer, the door you are required to open is the door for the dragon keepers, who can not fly. Now I am sure there must be other exits from the cave which dragons could fly through. I mean it looks as if Zerk is in some type of chimney or maybe a volcano so up would be out if you could fly.

Elf

Time for a couple of short

Time for a couple of short side trips

:twisted: Dwarf

Quests unlocking access; ToH

iryan wrote:
You have highlighted a problem though with the Bandits and the Stone. I'll have to put my thinking cap on. My first thoughts would be to make them only appear if you get the quest but considering my difficulties with blocking access to Zerk, Flick sometimes has a problem with distance triggers that aren't in the frustrum. That's why you got the "Major Kawalski is currently busy" message when you tried to talk to him.

I'll try that first and then if it doesn't succeed I'll use the good old door and key approach as that seems very robust and works all (most) of the time.

This lack also extends to some of the Legendary Maps as for example the Orchard Cellar Quest in Elddim in the Utraean Peninsula. You can actually enter the cellar and kill the spiders and so prevent the quest from ever being able to be completed. Not that I've ever received any reports on that but it's obviously possible to do. Same for Edgaar's cellar in the Kingdom of Ehb.

Iryan, Can a quest/task's active status unlock doors etc without a Lore Item needed as key? Yes, surely, because the Arhok town gates worked that way in DS1-LoA. (Or is that the kind of trigger you were attempting with Kawalski and the dragon?)

To reach the Stone in the crypts there is a whole series of doors in the lower level one must open. To reach the bandits one must take the elevator down to the forest - could the lever be locked until the quest-giver (right beside it) is spoken to? In Edgaar's cellar and the Elddim orchard cellar, could the automatic elevator to the lower level be made not to work unless one has the quest?

For thoroughness, lock the Mounine exit gates to stop players perverse enough to have ignored Oracle and not got the task to go to the fort.

(Suggested conversations for the two Mounine gate militia without (you can tell which is for which gate!):

"Your arriving is the only thing to have happened here all winter."
"Move along quickly, please, and remember to shut the gates behind you.")

With Kawalski and Tcherniat, it will be quite an achievement to get the fight with the drakes right, so both survive but without killing the beasts so quickly the party's help isn't needed, for all levels of party that Monster Level Adjustment could be adjusting the drakes to.

I was saving this until you got the quests right, but it follows on from the above:

A3#009. Should the fort's portal point be inside its cave instead of out? Before entering the cave I tried a Summon Teleport from the fort interior and got a portal back to Mounine. From inside the cave I tried a Summon Teleport and got a portal back to the centre of the fort, above ground, arriving in the middle of a fresh battle against re-spawned drakes.

(Ideally, for the sake of the storyline, I'd prefer the fort to be one place monsters do not re-spawn.)

A3#900 (900 number series for my artistic opinions as opposed to gameplay issues). Pedro in the original was being attacked by, and knocked out by, an ice fly he was trying to fight off with only his fists. Meeting him as an armoured and weapon-bearing melee fighter makes most implausible the story of him being unable to fight his way out without the party's help. Suggested solution: he has no gear. This would be one way round the problem of getting his gear right for his (adjustable!) level. (Could he be made to drop some money as a quest reward so you can buy him gear? Is a quest reward one of the drops that Monster Level Adjustment can adjust the value of?)

A3#901. How does Pedro being a half-giant yet brother to the quest-giver woman Yolanda square with the canonical lore of half-giants as a race? (Simple solution - adjust the quest-giving conversation rather than his race.)

Rat Already Done

bare_elf wrote:
Playing through the original map just to see where the differences are between the DS1 and DS2 versions. One thing I noted right away is that the Giant Rat does not move from the side of the shed until you get within about a few yards. It is as if he has been frozen and then starts patrolling when he senses someone near. You can kill him in advance of getting the quest and although you get the quest from old man fossil the quest will never complete. This is true of all the quests as I picked up the stone in the crypt and killed the bandits under the house before asking for the quests. That was a flaw in how the DS1 Quests operated. So Maybe in the DS2 version of the map as far as the rat quest goes maybe the rat should be invisible until you get the quest. Just a thought.

Elf


I've actually have done what you've suggested and it works well for the Rat. I've also made it impossible to kill Zerk before getting to that point in that quest.

You have highlighted a problem though with the Bandits and the Stone. I'll have to put my thinking cap on. My first thoughts would be to make them only appear if you get the quest but considering my difficulties with blocking access to Zerk, Flick sometimes has a problem with distance triggers that aren't in the frustrum. That's why you got the "Major Kawalski is currently busy" message when you tried to talk to him.

I'll try that first and then if it doesn't succeed I'll use the good old door and key approach as that seems very robust and works all (most) of the time.

This lack also extends to some of the Legendary Maps as for example the Orchard Cellar Quest in Elddim in the Utraean Peninsula. You can actually enter the cellar and kill the spiders and so prevent the quest from ever being able to be completed. Not that I've ever received any reports on that but it's obviously possible to do. Same for Edgaar's cellar in the Kingdom of Ehb.

bare_elf's picture
ToH

Playing through the original map just to see where the differences are between the DS1 and DS2 versions. One thing I noted right away is that the Giant Rat does not move from the side of the shed until you get within about a few yards. It is as if he has been frozen and then starts patrolling when he senses someone near. You can kill him in advance of getting the quest and although you get the quest from old man fossil the quest will never complete.
This is true of all the quests as I picked up the stone in the crypt and killed the bandits under the house before asking for the quests. That was a flaw in how the DS1 Quests operated. So Maybe in the DS2 version of the map as far as the rat quest goes maybe the rat should be invisible until you get the quest. Just a thought.

Elf